The Price of Principle: John Kiriakou on Conscience, Prison, and Staying Humble
1 hr 15 min
In this episode of Up2, we sit down with renowned former CIA officer John Kiriakou and we ask some questions he has not previously been posed. He spent years in counterterrorism, helped capture Abu Zubaydah, and became the first U.S. government official to publicly confirm the CIA’s use of waterboarding—paying for that decision with his career, his pension, and 23 months in federal prison. Now a bestselling author, podcaster, and teacher whose recent interviews have reached tens of millions, Kiriakou reflects on the personal cost of speaking up, the unexpected viral fame that followed, and how he has stayed grounded through it all. A thoughtful conversation about principle, humility, civil discourse, and finding optimism after the storm.